Let's talk Fuzz (part. ?)

[Mike_Sims]

I'm usually a big muff or some kind of muff variant type guy, but recently I've been wanting to check out how something more "traditional" or "splatty" sounds. I've been thinking about checking out some fuzz faces or something along those lines, but I can't for the life of me find ANY FUCKING VIDEOS ON YOUTUBE WHERE PEOPLE AREN'T PLAYING AT AN ALMOST CLEAN LEVEL. Anyways, I know the Big Muff can get pretty "splatty"/nasty sounding, doesn't seem to work too well on my Model T's though, I notice it works best on amps like Marshalls, Fenders, (non-master) etc. Yes, I know about the swollen pickle, used to have one, regret getting rid of it.  

The only videos I can find to my liking would be the Oxfuzz videos, but, I'm not sure how close to Fuzzface's they are..

[At_Giza]

I feel the pain with the youtube demos. No one seems to be able to get fuzz demos right. I don't even think FBG does it right every time.

Anyway, the dood who makes the OxFuzz says it's based on the Arbiter Fuzz Face, of course with upgrades, but if we take the Fender Model T as an example, just because something is said to be an upgraded version of something doesn't really mean that. I think the OxFuzz definitely has the Fuzz Face vibe just with much, much more tonal variations available from it.

I use a Mountainking Electronics Megalith, which does have the ability to get splatty. Also use a Sunn Buzz, but only to add a lot of mids and a bit of highs to on tap distortion from the amp I'm running it through (in this case it's my betas). The Buzz is indeed quite traditional, but it's pretty gutless, it's not one for a lot of low end. I just use it as a supplement, heh.

[dunwichamps]

I have a fuzzface pedal here which I just built with a FAC type control. they are pretty tight if its silicon transistors. I also have a germanium fuzzface which I built is much more wild, very raw. It can get sorta ragged if you adjust the internal trimmer to bias the output transistor in a hard manner

Are you looking to buy one or just fuck with it?

If you wanna test drive one let me know, you can borrow the Ge FF I have.

[Volume]

I love my Meatheads, MJM London Fuzz and Devi Ever TP, all based on the fuzz face (well, not sure about the TP, but it sounds like one). Great thing about the MJM especially is how it cleans up by lowering the volume on the guitar, all the way to mild overdrive type sounds. The Meathead does that too, but it also gets treblier, the MJM sounds more natural through the whole range.

I'd like a good Muff too. Which are the ones do you like best?

[dunwichamps]

I love my Meatheads, MJM London Fuzz and Devi Ever TP, all based on the fuzz face (well, not sure about the TP, but it sounds like one). Great thing about the MJM especially is how it cleans up by lowering the volume on the guitar, all the way to mild overdrive type sounds. The Meathead does that too, but it also gets treblier, the MJM sounds more natural through the whole range.

I'd like a good Muff too. Which are the ones do you like best?

LSTR and Pharaoh, more LSTR for very clean amps, Pharaoh for overdriven amps

[Mike_Sims]

Are you looking to buy one or just fuck with it?

If you wanna test drive one let me know, you can borrow the Ge FF I have.

Not sure yet... Mostly to fuck with for now, just to see if it's something I could get into. That's a cool gesture on your part dude. I may take you up on that someday.

I'd like a good Muff too. Which are the ones do you like best?

I have a ramshead clone I made, the tone is awesome BUT it lacks a little low end. There's another I made from GGG (general guitar gadgets) but added some new things to it (white LED's for diodes, higher valued resistors in the gain stages, mid-range knob, different tone stack, etc) and it sounds pretty bitchin'. VERY loud output, it'll put my amp into distortion even with the sustain level all the way down.

I guess I'll just demo a few out from some people and see what happens? Or I could always just make a FF, at least they don't require a lot of parts.

[dunwichamps]

I got a lot of gear hanging around so if you want to check it out no problemo. You could always build one, there super easy. Mine is a GGG kit but with NOS Ge parts and a powder coated chassis

For a frame of reference here is a demo of one my amps where I use 3 different pedals, BAT Pharoah, LSTR, and then my GeFF. Demo is long so you gotta scroll around to see when I use each pedal. I use them in the order listed here and you know i change when the gain is cut to 0 and there silence for a few moments.

Heres the same amp but just clips

GeFF

http://soundcloud.com/new05002/metro-clipped-with-homebrew-ge

BAT Pharaoh

http://soundcloud.com/new05002/metro-clean-clipped-with

http://soundcloud.com/new05002/dark-pharaoh-less-gain

LSTR

http://soundcloud.com/new05002/metro-clean-with-lstr

[Hemisaurus]

From memory, pickle, supercollider are both Muff derivatives. You can do like Duwich with a FAC or like the Supercollider with a pot and big capacitor, but being able to adjust the first capacitor drastically effects the sound of the whole circuit. It's like a 10uF and a 100K pot across the input cap. Or a rotary switch and a selection of caps for FAC.  Grab your muff, suck it and see.

[dunwichamps]

I gotta get a demo up soon, damn neighbors

[MikeyT]

I have a fuzzface pedal here which I just built with a FAC type control. they are pretty tight if its silicon transistors. I also have a germanium fuzzface which I built is much more wild, very raw. It can get sorta ragged if you adjust the internal trimmer to bias the output transistor in a hard manner.

     Could anyone tell me which (silicon or germanium) would best get me into the stooges' Funhouse territory ?




                       

[Baltar]

I'm not sure what Ron used.  I'm gonna go with Ge, based on how raspy it is.  The Ox Fuzz was the best FF I've ever heard/owned.

[MikeyT]

   Thanks. 

   There can never be too many Fuzz threads, imho.

[grimniggzy]

Asheton mainly relied on simple setups with very few effect pedals.[6]

Guitars
Reverend Ron Asheton Signature guitar (Custom Volcano 390)
Reverend Jetstream guitar
Gibson Les Paul
Gibson Flying V
Fender Stratocaster
Gibson SG Jr.

Effects
Vox Wah
Reverend Drive Train
Mosrite Fuzzrite
Ibanez Tube Screamer
Vox Tone Bender

Amplification
Vox Super Beatles Amp
Marshall 1959
Marshall JCM 800
Marshall JCM 900
Sunn 2000S

from wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Asheton

[Chovie D]

Perhaps peoples definition of splatty and nasty differs, I dont think of muffs as splatty at all, but the splattiest nastiest fuzz I own would be the Mosrite Fuzzrite...that thing is just rude and crude.


other splatty ones I own...Maestro Fuzz Tone...and the zvex fuzz factory gets some super splatty velcro shit going on but I find it unusable for the most part. I also have a JOrdan Boss Tone thats has nice vintage sound, but its more smoooth than splatty.

none of this sounds like what you want tho..kinda sounds like you want something thats juts a bit gnarlier than a big muff.  like maybe a Tone Bender or a superfuzz?

[Hemisaurus]

Beautifully simple.

[Chovie D]

yes really simple...the maestro also...i love these old fuzzs with like 5 components!
there is a germ version and a silicon version of the fuzzrite..and a couple variants on those as well I think...including one where the components are sealed into an orange glob like so

the version I have has(had) masking tape covering the board, the board looks like this

I think someone makes a well regarded clone...the Buzzrite?

[Chovie D]

maestro fz1

[Fuhgawz]

I prefer hybrid when it comes to Fuzz Faces. Silicon for the first transistor and germanium for the second. That way you don't have the temperature instability of an all germanium Fuzz Face, but the "Fuzz"-transistor is germanium, so the tone is more like a germanium Fuzz Face. I've had great results with OC140 or 2N1308 for the germanium transistor and a low gain silicon, like 2N2369A or 2N3440 for the silicon transistor. The original silicon Fuzz Faces are said to have high gain transistors (BC108C), but believe me, it sounds better with low gain silicons. Higher gain transistors make the Fuzz Face sound too bright and scratchy. You can smooth out the silicon transistor a little by placing a small ceramic cap (like 100pF or 220pF) between the base and collector, which I suggest you do. Low gain Si with ceramic cap for Q1 + Ge for Q2 makes a smooth and fat sounding Fuzz Face. At least, those are my experiences with this circuit.

If you want a more splatty sound then you just need to bias the second transistor a little higher than recommended. Maybe 5,5-6 volts? BTW, if you DO want an all germanium Fuzz Face, you really need an external bias pot for the second transistor. Otherwise it will be unuseable if you aften play at different temperatures.

If you want it to sound less woolly you can decrease the 2,2uF input cap to 1uF (film) and/or the 22uF on the Fuzz control to 15uF or 10uF. I also like the output cap to be 22nF instead of 10nF to let more 'clean' bass out.

[dunwichamps]

My version has switchable input transistors one has a normal HFE of ~100 while the other has one from 5k to 7k. So it gets you supersaturated. I am still messing with 2nd transistor but I have one currently in there with hfe around 100

[Baltar]

Grimnigzy, most of that gear you listed was pretty new stuff.  I'll bet anything he used a Fuzzrite on the first albums.  Chris Woojek was Ron's last tech, and I know him.  But I'm sure he prolly wouldn't know if I asked him either since he delt with Ron's last rig.  Ask Jor el, he met Ron too. 

[Hemisaurus]

maestro fz1

Sounds like utter shit. I've had to fix a couple, I think they sound better when they don't pass a sound.

[MikeyT]

   Yeah, I heard the Maestro was horrible. It didn't sound very good on the Stones' 'Satisfaction'.

Maybe it's value was in the launching of an idea.


      Supposedly Ron said he used a Fuzz Face for Funhouse.

I realize that sometimes people get mixed up and don't remember everything correctly. He may also have had various fuzzboxes at the time. Saw that on the interweb, too.

[grimniggzy]

Grimnigzy, most of that gear you listed was pretty new stuff.  I'll bet anything he used a Fuzzrite on the first albums.  Chris Woojek was Ron's last tech, and I know him.  But I'm sure he prolly wouldn't know if I asked him either since he delt with Ron's last rig.  Ask Jor el, he met Ron too. 

It's just the shit that was listed on the wikipedia. Bet it was the Mosrite though.

[MikeyT]

    Either way, the Mosrite seems to be a good choice. Never had one, but that apparently it was the box Iron Butterfly used for In-a-Gadda-da-Vida, which sounded really cool.

 

[Mike_Sims]

Kind of a shot in the dark here, but after seeing Dave Chandler use one, I've been curious about the Micro Metal Muff?