HIWATT G200 HD

[harm.on.x]

I just heard about a HIWATT G200 HD for sale just a few blocks away from where I live. This is good ol' Europe, so bear in mind that  prices are higher than the U.S.

From what I understand, HIWATT G200 HD is a solid state amp. The guy is selling both the amp and a Hiwatt Maxwatt M 412 straight cab. I don't know if he would agree to sell them separately, I'll ask. I would personally prefer to just get the amp and find a 2x12.

What's the consensus on those amps? Are they a yes or a no go?
How about the Maxwatt M 412 cab?

What would be a good deal for the head alone or the whole head and cab set?
Thanks in advance!

[Mr. Foxen]

Wouldn't bother, tacky SS amp with expensive badge on. Modern Hiwatt are total shysters. Cab might be OK if its as cheap as any other cheapo cab. Their sales pitch is 'people use out more expensive models'.

[harm.on.x]

Thanks! I'll stay away from it. Is there any SS head or combo you would recommend? I'm not interested in "modeling" amps. Just a plain simple amp but SS instead of valve. Is there any SS that would get your stamp of approval?

[James1214]

I'm not sure about on your side of the pond, but here in the states you can still score Acoustic heads in the cheap. My Acoustic 230 whicb as far as i can tell is from around '78 cost me $120 and is the best head I've ever owned. Its reliable, light, and louder than fuck plus the reverb actually sounds fantastic. I only ever have to put the volume to 2 or 3.

[RacerX]

Been hearing a lotta buzz about...

http://www.quilterlabs.com

[liquidsmoke]

but "why would anyone need 200 watts for guitar??!!" 

I wish more companies made 200+ watt clean channel guitar amps and simple clean channel guitar preamps.

[jibberish]

I saw this:

http://cleveland.craigslist.org/msg/4123068815.html



Also, I saw a carvin 1000w bass head for $300 bucks too. what about something like that?

and finally, why not get a PA amp. most have L+R gains so you dial in how "hi" the gain is, and they get fearsome bridged into 4 ohms.
like QSC, crown, peavey, [cough]behringer, and so on...

just some thoughts on the subject...

[harm.on.x]

I will need a preamp in front of the PA amps, no?

[Mr. Foxen]

I will need a preamp in front of the PA amps, no?

Yep, Sansamp character pedals are good.

[moose23]

Sansamp Character and Behringer nuke power amp would be cheapest decent SS set up in Europe unless you find better/cheaper power amp for less.

[Mr. Foxen]

Sansamp Character and Behringer nuke power amp would be cheapest decent SS set up in Europe unless you find better/cheaper power amp for less.

Power amps from Thomann, T-amp I think do some good cheap lightweights, been recommended by sound engineer.

[liquidsmoke]

Been hearing a lotta buzz about...

http://www.quilterlabs.com

Do you know how much their heads go for?

[RacerX]

$699 list price for the micro pro 200:

http://www.quilterlabs.com/index.php/products/amplifiers/micropro-200-head

$549 for the Aviator Pro 100:

http://www.quilterlabs.com/index.php/products/aviator-amplifiers/aviator-powerplant-deluxe

[liquidsmoke]

That isn't too bad for a US made amp.

[RacerX]

There are some demos on youtube.

The high gain sound isn't excellent, but the clean & classic sounds are very sweet & reportedly take pedals very well.

[harm.on.x]

Power amps from Thomann, T-amp I think do some good cheap lightweights, been recommended by sound engineer.

Good to know! I'll check the out today. Now, a question that might be a silly one but it's worth asking anyway.
I usually set my amps eq controls flat, in essence bypassing the preamp's eq. Always.
So I was thinking...what if I use my Boss line selector pedal to boost my signal up to line level and go straight to power amp?
Signal chain would be: guitar->fuzz pedal->boss ls2->power amp-> 2x12 guitar cab.

[Mr. Foxen]

Good to know! I'll check the out today. Now, a question that might be a silly one but it's worth asking anyway.
I usually set my amps eq controls flat, in essence bypassing the preamp's eq. Always.

Doesn't even nearly work like that. putting all the knobs in the middle doesn't bypass the eq, and plenty aren't flat with the knobs in the middle, some aren't flat anywhere. The most common valve amp eqs are like this, with no flat setting.

So I was thinking...what if I use my Boss line selector pedal to boost my signal up to line level and go straight to power amp?
Signal chain would be: guitar->fuzz pedal->boss ls2->power amp-> 2x12 guitar cab.

"Line level" isn't a well defined level, you need to find the voltage sensitivity of your chosen power amp and find something that can output that much voltage swing, its usually between 0.75v and 1.5v, some valve amps need more. Sansamp stuff gives about 1v which is ok for most modern power amps. Doubt the line selector goes that hot.

[harm.on.x]

Doesn't even nearly work like that. putting all the knobs in the middle doesn't bypass the eq, and plenty aren't flat with the knobs in the middle, some aren't flat anywhere. The most common valve amp eqs are like this, with no flat setting.

Yeah, I know that they are not flat with the knobs in the middle. This is a pretty common misconception but it's not what I do. I've seen diagrams with the most common tone stacks and how they work.

"Line level" isn't a well defined level, you need to find the voltage sensitivity of your chosen power amp and find something that can output that much voltage swing, its usually between 0.75v and 1.5v, some valve amps need more. Sansamp stuff gives about 1v which is ok for most modern power amps. Doubt the line selector goes that hot.

Thank you for this bit of information! This is very useful! I wish the Ls-2 manual had any info on that but unfortunately it hasn't. I used it the way I described with a small ss amp and I got more than OK results. It was with a tiny thing for apartment-volume practice though.
The manual says that  the LS-2 can give up to 20 dB volume boost. This is all the info I can gather.

EDIT: I forgot to say...you have the most amasing amp collection I've seen! I know you are not keeping all that stuff and you buy, fix and sell but I truly admire the work you've done on some of those amps!

[liquidsmoke]

Sansamp stuff gives about 1v which is ok for most modern power amps.

1v with the volume all the way up?

I'd love to see a clean preamp type pedal or simple rack unit with eq knobs which could be used or bypassed that could go up to any level so it could be used with any power amp.

Side note, using a bass amp for guitar into guitar speakers works out pretty good if you tune low and use a lot of distortion from a pedal. If you kick that pedal off and want to play clean however it sounds much more bass like, too much in fact. I should get a guitar preamp to run into the power section of my amp. Or I could possibly experiment with my MXR 10 band eq pedal and see if I can get my rig to sound more guitar like.

[jibberish]

I agree. the whole game is compatable input-output of the 2 devices connected.
you look to see what the v range to drive the power amp to full output is, and check the output v range of the driving device

impedances should be within an order of magnitude or the fidelity will get strangled.
line level is "sort of high impedance" so there are quite a lot of variations out there.

maximum power transfer occurs at equal impedances, the further off you get the further down the hill you go.

once you get the hang of this you can mix all kinds of stuff. I especially like using car stereo stuff mixed with home audio. differnet power supply is the only functional difference.

I will use car stereo active crossovers into PA amps when I get that all rigged just like I did with car stereo amps..no difference wrt to I/O, and feed it with a PC or CD player as a source..mix it all up from all over...power car stereo stuff with PC power supplies...just doesnt matter if the stuff matches up.

[jibberish]

if you have a little multimeter and some resistors or pots you can measure the output drive levels into a load if it isn't spec'd anywhere

set up a resistor to equal the input impedance of the device in question to be driven, across the outputs of the driving device.
measure the voltage across that resistor as you crank it up.  
if you need to drive the driver, a keyboard or something else that can just sustain a signal is really nice for this test like fm hiss.

different amp input impedances will affect the ultimate output level of the driving device too, ESPECIALLY if the amp is kind of lower input impedance and sucks the current right out of the drive signal.  line level isn't really a current thing, even tho it is relatively high voltage. err to the higher side of input impedance mismatches to get full voltage drive, albeit possibly at the sacrifice of some fullness if the difference is getting too big.

actually, the best drive would be a dc voltage that clamped the driver output to full out(the power rail). you need to know its max input for max output then...

[Mr. Foxen]

Sansamp stuff gives about 1v which is ok for most modern power amps.

1v with the volume all the way up?

Knob positions don't tell you anything. Output level is dependent on input level.

[liquidsmoke]

Sansamp stuff gives about 1v which is ok for most modern power amps.

1v with the volume all the way up?

Knob positions don't tell you anything. Output level is dependent on input level.

This is why I probably shouldn't mess with mixing a preamp and a poweramp, I don't even have even a basic understanding of this stuff.



That all sounds cool jibb but, yeah, I'm kind of clueless.