Stoner / Doom speakers?

Ombrenuit · February 23, 2012, 08:27:40 AM

Quote from: mutantcolors on February 22, 2012, 11:12:58 PM
Am I the first guy to think that wanting a more British sound than a gh1230 is an odd thing to desire? Is that not akin to wanting something more sugary than sugar?

Haha. I don't have a lot of experience with speakers. I'm not searching for a more British speaker, just a speaker that does stoner rock better. I'm open to American speakers. Just my research had pouinted me in the British direction.

Ombrenuit · February 24, 2012, 08:27:23 AM

Anyone have any experience with g12k100s? I was told they are like a g12t75 with a heavier magnet. Smooth highs and tight bass.

What exactly is loose bass vs tight? I heard it's the ability for the speaker to keep up with the notes in the bass frequencies. In which case, wouldn't loose bass be undesirable for upbeat stoner rock? The g12m has loose bass as far as I know.

The Riffer · February 24, 2012, 09:49:41 AM

I had a cab w a quad of g12h 100's..Celestion told me it was the predecessor to the K model, and was the same...It was really warm sounding, lots of emphasis on the low mids and lows..very relaxed highs..It worked very well on top of a cab with more aggressive speakers.. didn't tear your head off at high volumes.. May have been my cab, but I wouldn't have called it a tight bass...huge bass. but not tight..

Which is better?tight/loose? IDK, depends upon your style...I like a looser bass myself, the compression inherent to the speaker I think would dictate this...?

clockwork green · February 24, 2012, 12:43:59 PM

I love tight, chunky speakers especially when I'm palm muting or playing tighter, more precise stuff so I like EV's for that. If you want more of a looser low end for fuzzed out riffs it's hard to beat some Greenback style speaker...they're just so wrong, they're right especially when pushed hard.

Worthless Willie · February 24, 2012, 02:39:10 PM

18watts? I'd just get a Greenback.

Pissy · February 24, 2012, 02:45:36 PM

Just a word about the Eminence speakers...

I think they 're awesome, but as of about a year ago there was no recone kit available for them, the swamp thangs I had at least. If you're a fan of recycling like I am, it's something to consider. I had the same issue with some Mojotones as well.

Celestion G12T100's are pretty good in my book, and dirt cheap from Avatar's overstock section. No clue about the reconing aspect for these.

mawso · February 24, 2012, 04:49:30 PM

i wouldn't be looking to an 18 watt amp for downtuned riffage with lots of low end

i think that's really more the sticking point than the g12h30s.. a closed-back quad or a 2x12 of those is very much up to the task

i wouldn't be going with the 1X12, given the influences you mentioned.. not enough spread and just not enough, ummm, enoughness

ROWDYBEER · February 24, 2012, 05:21:11 PM

Clockwork green
Which ev's are best for tight palm muting etc.?

clockwork green · February 24, 2012, 05:52:51 PM

12L's are the standard. I've never tried the Black Label's.

Lumpy · February 24, 2012, 06:23:33 PM

I don't know dick about guitar speakers, but the Jet line from Jensen looks good -- Tornado, Blackbird and especially Electric Lightning which seems very aggressive.

Ombrenuit · February 25, 2012, 01:13:16 PM

Quote from: mawso on February 24, 2012, 04:49:30 PM
i wouldn't be looking to an 18 watt amp for downtuned riffage with lots of low end

i think that's really more the sticking point than the g12h30s.. a closed-back quad or a 2x12 of those is very much up to the task

i wouldn't be going with the 1X12, given the influences you mentioned.. not enough spread and just not enough, ummm, enoughness

Wattage determines headroom and volume. Speakers determine low end. Certainly I won't be able get as deafening as the influences I mentioned, but I won't be playing anywhere but bars, but the volume suits it's application. I'll also be able to get distortion as reasonable volumes.

Volume capacity doubles if you multiply the wattage by 10. Therefore a 100w amp is certainly louder than an 18w, but we're only talking about 50% louder.

4x12s offer lots of low end due to phase cancellation. Some frequencies are cancelled and others are enforced (low end). You can achieve a similar level of bass from a 1x12 with the right speaker and cabinet.

mawso · February 26, 2012, 06:23:18 AM

Quote from: Ombrenuit on February 25, 2012, 01:13:16 PM
Quote from: mawso on February 24, 2012, 04:49:30 PM
i wouldn't be looking to an 18 watt amp for downtuned riffage with lots of low end

i think that's really more the sticking point than the g12h30s.. a closed-back quad or a 2x12 of those is very much up to the task

i wouldn't be going with the 1X12, given the influences you mentioned.. not enough spread and just not enough, ummm, enoughness

Wattage determines headroom and volume. Speakers determine low end. Certainly I won't be able get as deafening as the influences I mentioned, but I won't be playing anywhere but bars, but the volume suits it's application. I'll also be able to get distortion as reasonable volumes.

Volume capacity doubles if you multiply the wattage by 10. Therefore a 100w amp is certainly louder than an 18w, but we're only talking about 50% louder.

4x12s offer lots of low end due to phase cancellation. Some frequencies are cancelled and others are enforced (low end). You can achieve a similar level of bass from a 1x12 with the right speaker and cabinet.

lower tunings and bassy tone needs more power - how many bass players are showing up with 18 watt amps?

18 watts is great for a really ballsy midrangey hard rock/classic rock kinda tone, which is what i go for, but given the bands you've namechecked it's a weird choice

Mr. Foxen · February 26, 2012, 07:51:44 AM

Quote from: Ombrenuit on February 25, 2012, 01:13:16 PM
Wattage determines headroom and volume. Speakers determine low end. Certainly I won't be able get as deafening as the influences I mentioned, but I won't be playing anywhere but bars, but the volume suits it's application. I'll also be able to get distortion as reasonable volumes.

That isn't right. Wattage means not much at all, volume is determined by speakers, specifically sensitivity. 18w into a 100db@1w@1m speaker will be as loud as 36w into a 97db@1w@1m (roughly a Vintage 30 vs a Hot100), this applies up until the speaker starts compressing and such at its own limit, which also isn't determined by its 'wattage' but by its excursion limit. Plus every time you double the number of speakers you add 3db of sensitivity (6db voltage sensitivity if in parallel, but not too applicable to valve amps). Low end sensitivity is mostly determined by the box the speaker is in, but also not very relevant to guitar because the mid voicing will determine most of what you perceive as 'low end', a high mid voiced speaker will give the impression of having less 'low end' than a low mid voiced one, even with exact same midbass sensitivity.

Quote from: Ombrenuit on February 25, 2012, 01:13:16 PM
4x12s offer lots of low end due to phase cancellation. Some frequencies are cancelled and others are enforced (low end). You can achieve a similar level of bass from a 1x12 with the right speaker and cabinet.

They offer lots of sensitivity because of lots of speakers in a bigish box, they have not much top off axis because of bad dispersion, which makes you think you have a bottomy sound when you are close to a 4x12 on the floor, but anyone in front and the mic on it are just as trebley as a 1x12. 1x12s usually have less bottom due to being in a small box.

The real limiting factor on how low an amp can go is the size of the output transformer.

VOLVO))) · February 26, 2012, 10:41:57 AM

Have I ever mentioned how valuable you guys are to this forum/in general?