The recording/mixing/mastering techniques thread

[Chovie D]

Your link is invisible dude unless its my phone not loading something? :*

Most people I know who've recorded layered up the guitars several times by hand which I'd love to try out in the future but I'm feeling that its good to keep things real and natural too, as for trying to thicken it up through mixing I think I'm actually ok with the sound of two mics each mono, I'm just not sure if I should be making the tracks stereo, but like I say I didn't hear a significant improvement from doing that...

Am I right in thinking that instead of using a delay of milliseconds when duplicating mono tracks you could instead eq them differently for the same purpose of making the separate tracks distinguishable?

I think I'm finished mixing this now, even more so because we gave the tracks to Soggy Bob for his latest show which was awesome of him

So much to learn....

your instincts are good, keep it simple, dont overthink it, dont do a million overdubs.

I made a soundcloud account. I cannot share the soloed drum track because there was so much bleeed it made it futile, so i heres the whole track. This is a duo, guitar and drums, no bass. we are improvising this "song" and a little drunk by this time. then I added some quick improved vocals and a fuzz probe guitar solo. so 2 mics, single mic on drumset, 4 total tracks, nothing doubled. not much eqing or panning.
the fuzzprobe solo is at the end for those of you wondering what that effect sounds like..im pretty happy with how that part turned out. so im posting this so you can get an idea of the single mic drum micing technique....cheers.
[soundcloud]https://soundcloud.com/chovis-mcd/shop-till-you-drop-mp3[/soundcloud]

[JemDooM]

I think you guys might need to post the links as I'm thinking there are embeds that aren't loading on my phone, stuck in work so no laptop!

[Chovie D]

https://soundcloud.com/chovis-mcd/shop-till-you-drop-mp3

or check it later...hope it helps some...

wait! you are going to listen to this on your phone?? 

[JemDooM]

That sounds awesome Chovie!! That fuzz is too awesome too! And yeah I'm stuck in work for 20 hours and these iPhone speakers are actually quite acceptable so forgive me!! I'll have a proper blast again at home though, I love home recordings, two peices and drunken music making!

[Chovie D]

cool thnx... we need a name.
I'm thinking something with Unicorns?

[RacerX]

Howsabout The Rainbow Unicorns?

[JemDooM]

Oohh i love anything to do with unicorns! im currently writing an epic song about them, through my research i found the following names for them in history: Re'em & Monoceros, also Julius Caeser spoke of seeing one in the 'Hercyniun Forest' a place "abound with wonders" so I suggest

Hercyniun Forest of Unicorns

[RAGER]

cool thnx... we need a name.
I'm thinking something with Unicorns?

Uni-cornholer

[Lumpy]

https://soundcloud.com/chovis-mcd/shop-till-you-drop-mp3

or check it later...hope it helps some...

wait! you are going to listen to this on your phone?? 

That was dope (do the kids still say that?) I liked the vocals a lot. And the guitar solo. Everything, really. Hell yeah.

[RAGER]

Recorded with a single H4 in a 10x10 room and it kinda sounds like it.  One off jam with an old drummer buddy.  funto listen to just the drums if anything.

[cloudset]https://soundcloud.com/rager-1/rager-markey[/cloudset]

Oh and that was killer chovie.  I'm on my second listen.

[Chovie D]

thanks people. all of what we are doing is improvised, which it turns out is a really fun but difificult way to get songs...most of it sounds like we wanna be "Crazy Horse". we have no clue what we are doing really

right now Im thinkin:
"Gay Unicorn"  for the band name?



whomever Coltsblood is, I listend to a track and it sounded good, the sounds were good...is that your group Jem?

[spookstrickland]

That sounded really good, super heavy fuzz tone!  I liked the Vocal F/X too.

[Chovie D]

vocal effect is a rat pedal sim (line 6 toneport)...and  digital  delay.
I think most of the "effect" is actually just the way i "sing"?

[spookstrickland]

vocal effect is a rat pedal sim (line 6 toneport)...and  digital  delay.
I think most of the "effect" is actually just the way i "sing"?

Sweet! my Buddy and I are getting into Fuzzes for Vocal and Harp Effects, I dig it!

[JemDooM]

vocal effect is a rat pedal sim (line 6 toneport)...and  digital  delay.
I think most of the "effect" is actually just the way i "sing"?

Yeah I think that's a lot of it! your vocals are awesome

Yeah Coltsblood is my stuff Chovie and thanks! Still trying to find my way with playing, sound and recording...

Need to try out my guitar delay for vocals next time as vocal effects pedals seem to be really expensive!

[Chovie D]

jem it sounds like you guys are defo on the right track, I thought the recorded sounds were good. the drums sound good! thats hard to do. your stuff might really benefit from a more pro mix when its time to finally lay it down because it will be nice to get some more separation between bass and guitar frequencies? Thats something I really struggle with in that kind of music. got any studio frineds who could give it a try for free?

I will usually put effects (other than dirt) on instruments or voices AFTER i record them..I am working in a DAW (tracktion 3) and using virtual effects. I use a set of free ones i downloaded and like alot , they are caled kjaerhaus classic series. good delay, compressor etc.
they can be found here
http://www.vstwarehouse.com/2011/06/kjaerhus-audio-classic-series.html

i use the delay and compressor on almost every recording I make

[JemDooM]

Thanks Chovie! It's hard to get separation from the guitar and bass frequencies because its all so down tuned and the guitar is through bass head/cabs, we're recording with Chris fielding late in the summer he's excellent at recording the heavy, I can't wait to learn from him I really want to record it all live but so far my bandmates disagree...

I like to add effects afterwards too just to start with a clean base and really hear what's going down...

I'm still confused over the actual difference between using the compressor and limiter? I'm really wary of both because I know they can take away from the real sound...

[Chovie D]

I never could get my head around how a copmressor works or what the terms mean..soft knee/ hard knee? attack, decay? I never figured it out, and i tried, even read some pretty heady books on the subject.

The effects I linked to have pre-sets and on the compressor I will use the presets (drums, vocals, etc).
I'll use compression on vocals and pedal steel  to even out the volume fluctuations.

My mastering software is the same way..i dont know how to work it...I just use a pre-set and maybe tweak the eq a tiny bit.

In short, i really dont know what I am doing when it comes to recording, but I am usually quite happy with the way my recordings sound..and thats all that matters in the end right?

Cheers

[JemDooM]

Hehe I know that one of them (attack or release?) controls how much of a loud sound e.g a harsh cymbal gets through before its cut?

I just mess around turning things back and forth to hear the difference, like you I read up on it but it didn't stick! I'll have to read it all up again!

[Drama]

If the ratio is 10:1 or above, you're limiting. If it's below 10:1 you're compressing.

[Chovie D]

you lost me at "ratio".. 

[Drama]

The ratio is basically the amount of compression applied, based on your threshold setting.

If you set the threshold to -10 dB and the ratio to 4:1 and you have a signal with a peak of say -6 dB, which is 4 dB over the threshold that signal will be reduced by 3 dB (4:1) so your actual output would end up being -9 dB.

It's really not the easiest thing to explain in text for me, it's a lot easier to show on an actual compressor.

I can mebee do a video or something to show a little easier.

[Chovie D]

thanks for trying. I think Im kinda hopeless. other people have tried to explain it to me beofre as well. ive read books, It juts kinda goes in one ear and out the other. thanks tho.

[jibberish]

hey chief, the mono mic drums are all there in that neato little piece. that was my main question.
I was thinking about spatial concerns via one mic, but actually some side to side space is maintained by the actual time delays to the mic since each kit piece is a different distance.  anyway, the perception flies nicely.
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compressor comments based on my alesis nano compressor which I used on vocals into my 4 track cassette a lot:

limiting=straight cutoff point. the knees and ratio is what got explained above. the more above the threshold you go , the harder the limiter sits on the gain
hard knee is a harsh kill switch, but you need that for keeping under an absolute drop dead threshold level. for example, stupid crap like  "P" pop can blow the meters away. it is an obnoxious sound anyway, so it makes no noticeable effect, just knocks the db's way down
if your signal isn't getting away from you , you don't need limiting at all, but maybe it should be there as a safety belt on any digital recordings, especially vocals. any digital recorder has limiting as an effect to be sure.  the Tascam dp-24 has a separate set of effects specifically for incoming recording.

here is the theory of comp, not that I really know how to use one correctly...yet.
compression is an effect to reduce the dynamic range of a signal. it squashes the loud and boosts the quiet.
can I use a parametric eq as an analogy?  ok. I can set a center frequency on my equalizer right? like I set the center to 10khz. ok so my eq boost/cut is now centered at 10k, but how wide is the effect? well I select the "Q" and maybe I choose a big one of 2 octaves w/e 5k-20k, or maybe I go the other way down to a little 1/3 octave spike(very small Q) so im only doing 1/3 octave like from  9k-13k.

you set the threshold on the compressor like your center freq on an eq. you set the compression amount/ratio like the Q on the eq. the knee is like the the rolloff on an eq, is it 20db/octave? 30? w/e  well the ratio is about that. how much boost/cut in volume with respect to the actual incoming volume

but watch it because goofy crap like the noise floor is really quiet and ergo becomes x db louder compared to compressed music material being squashed down. heavy comp starts the breathing bullshit.

I can walk through the ratio math like on paper, but I haven't played enough to really "feel" what the ratios mean so I have no subtle info on the use of the comp as an effect. I used the limiter basically.

also, you can tweak compression all day in your DAW once you have a clean take and redo all the booboos a thousand times

edit: you could consider a noise gate as a limiter on the bottom end. anything below a certain threshold is just cut off.

[eyeprod]

nice one e9th. that fuzz probe sounds great. I've been using my minibrute as a guitar and bass pedal, and whoa it does some mind blowing sounds. I tried the one mic on drums again in our practice space, but ended up keeping one on the kick and another just above it, more or less pointed towards the snare. Seems to be a good combo and simple. Oh man, I forgot to mention that I tried running the kick through a mixer and then into the minibrute audio in (then back into my bass rig) and that worked too. Kick can trigger a crazy oscillating drone, or just a short but very deep note that makes the kick more "electronic" or synthy sounding. Anything you want to do with it really. Pretty cool possibilities if you're into acid tones. Sounds like you are. I wanna get another one or two of these synths. For the price they make a really great sounding filter if nothing else.