The Jam Room Blog Thread.

[RAGER]

As a musician, my number one m.o. is have a house where I can play as loud as I want and own a vehicle tat I could load my shit into.

[liquidsmoke]

I'm seeing mention of speaker 'power compression' on some forums. Is this anything guitar players who tune low and use tube amps should be concerned about? To me the message is- make sure your speakers have enough watt headroom to avoid an eventual reduction in volume that turning up your amp won't solve. I'm probably getting this completely wrong though.

edit: http://www.sweetwater.com/insync/power-compression/

I think I may have experienced this with SS amps half way or two thirds of the way through practice.

Half way through practice stuff is probably your ears going, rather than speakers. Amp's power section compressing is going to be most of it, guitar speakers aren't doing subwoofer work and aren't even vaguely attempting to be linear anyway. Power compression is kind of a concern for bass, but neo drivers have loads better heatsinking so it isn't a current concern any more.

Ah.

[liquidsmoke]

Are you sure you aren't a woman? Manuals? The fuck!?

I don't give a fuck about speaker damage. If your impedances match, and the speakers are rated properly, you should never be able to hurt a speaker. Most damage comes from improper matches, over powering, poorly designed enclosures, poorly built speakers or user error.

You think too much, if you break something, it wasn't up to snuff. You dig?

I have a lot of faith in my speakers but I don't assume they can tolerate an infinite amount of heat. I read the 7 page PS802 manual to avoid a user error. It's awesome that you don't ever need to read manuals.

Also, all distortion = clipping

Yes. Melting voice coils is what I don't want to do so when the manual says not to run the amp with the peak indicator LED 'flashing excessively' I take that kind of seriously even while playing guitar. Turn the bass down, yes, that helps.

Your 'woman' comments are very entertaining. Now I want to get 16 1x10 cabs because it would irk some people.

[RacerX]

Your 'woman' comments are very entertaining. Now I want to get 16 1x10 cabs because it would irk some people.

Cool!

Just don't be surprised when it sounds like shit.

[liquidsmoke]

A sacrifice I'm willing to make for the ultimate she-rig.

[Lumpy]

A massive wall of Peavey Bandits would be totally stoner rock.

[Jake]

There used to be a pic floating around that was a rig of something like four Bandits wide by three tall – all daisy chained. I cannot find.

[everdrone]

my current doom bass rig: each cab weighs only 40 poundsand I can fit all of it in the back seats of my corrolla!!  maybe not doomz enuf??? I use tech 21 vt bass and decimator gstring for growl:

[everdrone]

this guy converted open back 212s to closed back orange cabs.  if I replace with neodymium speakers, each cab would only weigh 35 pounds!!!   

[liquidsmoke]

Nice rigs dude!

Oh, I mean, you're a woman!

[RacerX]

That's his bass rig.

You're talking about a guitar rig.

[Lumpy]

There used to be a pic floating around that was a rig of something like four Bandits wide by three tall – all daisy chained. I cannot find.

I made a gig flyer out of it once...



I think this might be an EQ issue at it's root. 100 watt guitar amp should be unbelievably loud. 100 watt bass amp, not so much. So if there was more midrange/less bass in his signal it might seem a lot louder. IMO, let the bass player handle those frequencies, but that's not my scene (so, it's easy for me to say...) One problem guitar players can have is 'more is better'. If a distortion is good, then more is better. If a bassy signal is good, then more is better. Not really true. Also, a 4x12 cabinet might be more satisfying than two 2x12s because of the benefit of a larger cabinet. Not certain of that, since speakers take up room, but usually, bigger box = more bass.

/dunno

[jibberish]

a speaker and it's cab volume. you can have 1 speaker in x volume or 4 speakers in 4x volume=no difference

if you built single cabs of equal volume and port tuning to a large cab, there would be no difference in sound since each speaker still deals with the same cab resonance etc.
y'all should read some speaker cab design books.

liquid, stay the course.   knowledge is power.   

[VOLVO)))]

I'm just picking on you, girl. ;-)

You constantly overthink this shit. It's pretty simple. I have NEVER blown a speaker or melted a voice coil. NEVER. Destroyed amps? Yeah that's different. I play BASS, CRANKED, out of two guitar 4x12s, REGULARLY.

I live to abuse my shit, it's only existence is to please me and take everything I throw at it. If something breaks? It will get fixed.

Seriously guitars, amps, cabs, etc are not babies. They are metal, wood, carbon, glass, whatever, and if it fucking breaks under normal use, well...

Do you seriously only drive the speed limit or -just- drink two beers? Your body is a metric fuckton more sensitive than guitar equipment and yet people treat it like a fuckin sewer by drinking and smoking, eating fast food, pick your poison.

I have amps twice my fucking age that work, still.

So, unless your shit is made of flowers and butterflies, it will be just fine.

[VOLVO)))]

I got this truck with 27 miles on it in late 08. I have not been good to it. I drive it fast, hard, I do not maintain it well, and it does not have an easy life.

I keep synthetic oil in it, and keep good plugs/wires in it. That's it. It has never failed me to a point that I could not rectify it on the side of the road. Just to drive the point home, it has the original serpentine belt on it. 316k on one belt. 4 cylinder Ford Ranger.

Shit is tough. Real tough. I put a clutch in it at 270k. Tried to pull too much one time and lunched it. Original alternator, air compressor everything. I've had a check engine light since 127k. (return sensor for coolant temp gauge is bad.)

Don't believe everything you read. Im not saying treat your shit like I do mine but I am saying don't just... Pussyfoot around it.

[jibberish]

I was thinking now about what I have destroyed over time.  mostly just ss amp output sections and tweeters. I don't think I have ever melted a woofer voice coil unintentionally either.    a cool sound is when the voice coil starts hitting the back of the frame.


that bass rig is dialed in really nicely.  all in a corolla is awesome. I can barely get myself into a corolla. I would love to see the video of M&B getting into a corolla

[VOLVO)))]

I take all the tweeters out of my shit.

[liquidsmoke]

As jibb said, knowledge is power so we are talking about gear, I'm sorry if my questions are annoying to some. I'm not good at fixing stuff so when I spend money on gear I want to know at least the essential info so I don't blow it up even if it's hard to blow up. Instrument cables can work in place of speaker cables but I don't want to be that guy. Sounds like you've got yourself a nice truck Sunn.

[VOLVO)))]

Eh, it's barebones, but i practically live in it.

[jibberish]

I take all the tweeters out of my shit.

how do your nearfield computer monitors sound with no tweeters?

[VOLVO)))]

I mean cabs, and shit you grouchy dildo

[jibberish]

heh

I am cleaning up the old cortez lp copy which I bought used in like 1978, so it is fucking used now.  all electronics are suspect.  so I was going to yank the pup selector toggle switch except it isn't a toggle switch. this rig looks like a double 1/4" jack inside where a little blade just pushes 2 contactors together.  I think I can just clean it and it will be quiet again. very nice surprise.

the pots are in bad shape tho, and the jack is stretched so it needs replacing.  
I should take a pic, the finish is aging and looks really nice. too bad most of the gold plating has worn off the hardware. those japs knocked off a black beauty all the way down to the same grover tuners and even triple binding.

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edit: i'm doing nightwatch on the thermometer. I have 14 flats of vegetables and a dozen large tomatos and it MAY frost tonight. I think i'm going to make it..about 39-40 degrees right now.....if I see the white starting on the grass, I have to shuffle all that shit inside. so between hourly checks, i'm practicing some guitar, tearing another one apart, looking for a fight, and in general finding stuff to do in the middle of the fucking night

[jibberish]

. Is there any way to know for sure if your speakers are overheating when they are clipping before damage starts to occur?

I don't know of anything up to the point you can smell the coil insulation burning. what happens is the insulation, which is really thin laquer or wtf, starts burning and letting turns of the coil touch. each loop of coil that touches cuts it out and lowers impedance=moar current=moar heat=moar damage.

that is the only way I know of , and that is already damage. a partly damaged speaker just starts losing its schmoltz, like not as snappy or as loud, and total failure is imminent as the rest of the coils short and the amp starts kicking out due to short protection or the speaker finally quits.

I did in my 5-1/4 car woofers in the door with 100w rms and van halen's eruption in one of the tunnels on I77 in w va.  they were frizzy sounding after that.  I rocked the fuck out of the tunnel. everyone was looking heh. the whole stereo was 14speakers 1200 watts rms tri-amped.  sucked the big cap dry and everything heh. my ears were ringing like I was at a loud show. it was so fucking loud

I see speaker wires break where they go through the cone, but you can fix those and that is only mechanical.

tweeters go right up in smoke. heh. I have seen too many tweeters die. have killed a ton myself.

[RAGER]

I blew each and every one of my g12k-85's with either my Marshall or my orange. But like jakeo)) said, shit wasn't right. Corrosion built up in the gap. Must have been stored in a moist environment at points.  I love those speakers and scoop them up when i find them. Luckily never trashed one during a show. Always during four hour brutalizing practices.

[RAGER]

I think M&B drives a Miata.