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General Category => Jam Room => Topic started by: VOLVO))) on June 23, 2012, 01:08:25 PM

Title: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 23, 2012, 01:08:25 PM
So, basically, getting bands together in a college town is worthless and impossible. Everyone moves, or is too busy, can't afford gear, etc. I've been reduced to trying to write tunes by myself. Now, I'm a fairly proficient songwriter, I did it for a long time by myself, but after playing a band or two, and trying to go back to it.. I dont think I have it anymore. Ive been trying to write tunes with a looper pedal by playing riffs, then drumming to it. It's hard because a lot of the stuff is timed whacky or really fast, and there is no forgiveness or swing, body motions etc to take ques from with the looper. So I end up getting off from it all the time, then I feel like the riff is fucked up because I can't drum to it, etc. So basically Im stuck in an island with myself, a ridiculous amount of equipment, but no high quality riffs will come and I can't piece together tunes because nothing seems to fit together anymore.

is this a rut? Or is this shit forever?

Is it time?
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: RacerX on June 23, 2012, 01:18:11 PM
Do you mean quit playing or quit whining?

No to #1, yes to #2.

That's what you call tough love, young man.

Now go to yer room & play yer guitar until I tell you to come out.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: blackkrosses on June 23, 2012, 01:23:48 PM
I also live in a college town. It's like a revolving door of flake musicians that come, sometimes stay, but mostly go year in and year out.
I too find myself in  these ruts time and time again and always seem to pull through them somehow. Riffs don't make sense or fit anywhere, six months later I solve the problem. As for musicians to jam with I wish you the best of luck. It would be cool if you could find a band that gives a fuck. You obviously can play and your gear is top-notch.

Chin up.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: dunwichamps on June 23, 2012, 02:10:33 PM
Move to CT, Work for Dunwich, Write riffs for me
Title: Re: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 23, 2012, 02:17:51 PM
That's the best idea yet! You should send all of your amps to me for... testing! You know, like as an application? Hahaha...
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: fallen on June 23, 2012, 02:38:26 PM
I don't know how it is for other people but when I was younger I used to put a ton of effort into every song, memorizing the whole thing and planning it all out, and then when 2 or 3 songs in a row didn't work out or sounded like crap it would get a bit depressing.

Then later while doing graphic design work I learned that a lot of ideas don't end up working and the best way to work was to do lots of rough concepts and then edit ruthlessly. Be creative and then apply hard work.

When the creative juices are really flowing I might get 2 or 3 ideas in a row that work out. Sometimes I'll trash a dozen ideas in a row. The key is to not spend hours on each one of those 12 ideas that get edited into the trash bin.

I do this with music to. Get rough ideas to tape, out of time, lots of mistakes, add in some improvised parts. Doesn't matter. If I ever think of a riff I record it with whatever is handy, usually my phone.

Then later I'll listen back and if anything still sounds good to me I might develop it into a full song. I only put in work on the 10% best riffs.

I have a terrible memory for riffs, I think I'll remember one and then a day later it's gone so rough recordings are the only way I can keep them straight. And waiting a few days makes it easy to edit. I just listen like it's someone else playing and edit them ruthlessly.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Glitchyghost on June 23, 2012, 02:58:43 PM
Just look at Wino.  Then ask yourself that question again.   Then shut up and turn up.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Baltar on June 23, 2012, 03:46:22 PM
It's rough, basically you either wait it out and hope for the best, or move to where it's happening.  Unfortunately, "where it's happening" is usually an expensive city or Europe.  I finally lucked out last month, I found a bass player and drummer that just happened to be married and have killer equipment and their own practice space.  I really lucked out.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: franksnbeans on June 23, 2012, 03:53:42 PM
Move out here to oakland!  We'll jam. 
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: clockwork green on June 23, 2012, 04:42:22 PM
I think the best thing black metal has done was to show everyone that a one man band could still be damn good.  It's maybe not the most satisfying but I just can't stop making music...finishing music is another story but there are just too many things in my head to not attempt to get them out. 

I was watching the Floor DVD and at one point they talked about how they lived in all sorts of different places and just met up a few times a year to record and tour.  I'm sure there's other people in various parts of Florida that you'd be willing to drive to once a month or so.  I know the older I get the less into practicing twice a week (or even once a week)...I'll still write stuff at home all the time but taking 3-4 hours out of my day to go over 1 or 2 new riffs. 

The other option is relocating but there are a lot of other things to consider with that. 
Title: Re: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: dunwichamps on June 23, 2012, 06:01:12 PM
Quote from: SunnO))) on June 23, 2012, 02:17:51 PM
That's the best idea yet! You should send all of your amps to me for... testing! You know, like as an application? Hahaha...
Move first then we will chat
Title: Re: Re: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 23, 2012, 06:23:12 PM
Quote from: clockwork green on June 23, 2012, 04:42:22 PM
I think the best thing black metal has done was to show everyone that a one man band could still be damn good.  It's maybe not the most satisfying but I just can't stop making music...finishing music is another story but there are just too many things in my head to not attempt to get them out. 

I was watching the Floor DVD and at one point they talked about how they lived in all sorts of different places and just met up a few times a year to record and tour.  I'm sure there's other people in various parts of Florida that you'd be willing to drive to once a month or so.  I know the older I get the less into practicing twice a week (or even once a week)...I'll still write stuff at home all the time but taking 3-4 hours out of my day to go over 1 or 2 new riffs. 

The other option is relocating but there are a lot of other things to consider with that.

I love a lot of those one man black metal deals. I guess I just feel so... fake? Writing with a drum machine, even if I am going to record real drums later. I can do it, but it's hard because I want to hear something half assed decent while I'm listening. I guess I could be over analyzing it....
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: RacerX on June 23, 2012, 06:25:20 PM
QuoteThe other option is relocating but there are a lot of other things to consider with that.

Dude's an ordained minister—he can move anywhere.  8)

I done seen his Reverend Certificate, erm, Certificate of Reverence? Whatever you call it.
Title: Re: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 23, 2012, 06:31:23 PM
Dio guides me.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Mr. Foxen on June 23, 2012, 07:15:25 PM
I pretty much only write miserable music, when I can't right music, means I'm getting my life right. Got some family shit going down shortly so look out for a Warrior Pope EP. When I'm not doing music myself, I'm busy making other music happen though.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Pissy on June 23, 2012, 09:47:08 PM
Reading this thread makes me thank my lucky stars for the band I'm in. Though by nature our band just goes off the cuff much of the time so creative development occurs right then and there, then is largely gone. Also we don't practice enough to get burned out, so when we do get together it's like relieving blue balls.

It's funny the college town thing... I recall being envious of Chapel Hill's scene when I was younger and never really considered the fact that people come and go. How does that work?  Why are college towns historically good scenes when bands don't last?

Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: DustinAR on June 23, 2012, 10:21:35 PM
Forming a band is really pretty tasking. I have played with all kinds of people since I started playing guitar really, trying to form bands. 85% of them failed, but when you finally step into a room with folks that can get on your wavelength of thinking, its an absolutely beautiful thing. Keep going, you'll eventually find the right people, and you'll learn a lot along the way.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Sundholm on June 23, 2012, 10:58:06 PM
Shit, everyone should be an ordained minister.  Opens up the career options....
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Baxandall on June 23, 2012, 11:02:07 PM
This thread is relevant to my interests.
Title: Re: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 24, 2012, 12:19:32 AM
I don't know what I want any more. I wanna play death metal. I wanna play doom, sludge, black metal... noise rock, math rock, post rock, good ol' greasy rock'n'roll.
Title: Re: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: mortlock on June 24, 2012, 12:59:17 AM
Quote from: SunnO))) on June 24, 2012, 12:19:32 AM
I don't know what I want any more. I wanna play death metal. I wanna play doom, sludge, black metal... noise rock, math rock, post rock, good ol' greasy rock'n'roll.
if you can play all of that, id go where the best opportunity is to get whatever you want to get out of music in your life..
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: everdrone on June 24, 2012, 01:04:49 PM
Quote from: SunnO))) on June 23, 2012, 01:08:25 PM
So, basically, getting bands together in a college town is worthless and impossible. Everyone moves, or is too busy, can't afford gear, etc. I've been reduced to trying to write tunes by myself. Now, I'm a fairly proficient songwriter, I did it for a long time by myself, but after playing a band or two, and trying to go back to it.. I dont think I have it anymore. Ive been trying to write tunes with a looper pedal by playing riffs, then drumming to it. It's hard because a lot of the stuff is timed whacky or really fast, and there is no forgiveness or swing, body motions etc to take ques from with the looper. So I end up getting off from it all the time, then I feel like the riff is fucked up because I can't drum to it, etc. So basically Im stuck in an island with myself, a ridiculous amount of equipment, but no high quality riffs will come and I can't piece together tunes because nothing seems to fit together anymore.

is this a rut? Or is this shit forever?

Is it time?

I think anyone doing this would be in the same spot.  You really should get some basic recording gear and work on recording some real songs instead of messing with a looper and trying to drum to it etc.   Get ezdrummer for less than $100, download reaper, and get an interface like line 6 toneport for $100.  that is less cost than a good pedal!  then record bass and guitar.  make a ton of descent songs, then recruit musicians out of that. 

put in your craigslist ad "NO ILLEGAL DRUGS! NO FLAKES!"  this stops a lot of junkie flake types that commit to a practice then cancel last minute from contacting you.  music should be about music, if you cant find legit musicians then it is time to move or start recording songs.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: liquidsmoke on June 24, 2012, 01:14:59 PM
I live in a college town and there are tons of people here that stay for years, some even grew up here and never left. It's the early/mid 20 somethings that tend to come and go, the older folks tend to stick around.

If I wasn't in a band and couldn't find anyone for one I'd continue writing songs and just record everything myself, either get better at drums or use a computer for the drums, the programs have come a long way.

If you are sick of playing music it really may be time to *give it a rest* for awhile but I wouldn't recommend selling ALL of your gear, you are definitely young enough to regret that.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 24, 2012, 01:17:09 PM
Quote from: everdrone on June 24, 2012, 01:04:49 PM
Quote from: SunnO))) on June 23, 2012, 01:08:25 PM
So, basically, getting bands together in a college town is worthless and impossible. Everyone moves, or is too busy, can't afford gear, etc. I've been reduced to trying to write tunes by myself. Now, I'm a fairly proficient songwriter, I did it for a long time by myself, but after playing a band or two, and trying to go back to it.. I dont think I have it anymore. Ive been trying to write tunes with a looper pedal by playing riffs, then drumming to it. It's hard because a lot of the stuff is timed whacky or really fast, and there is no forgiveness or swing, body motions etc to take ques from with the looper. So I end up getting off from it all the time, then I feel like the riff is fucked up because I can't drum to it, etc. So basically Im stuck in an island with myself, a ridiculous amount of equipment, but no high quality riffs will come and I can't piece together tunes because nothing seems to fit together anymore.

is this a rut? Or is this shit forever?

Is it time?

I think anyone doing this would be in the same spot.  You really should get some basic recording gear and work on recording some real songs instead of messing with a looper and trying to drum to it etc.   Get ezdrummer for less than $100, download reaper, and get an interface like line 6 toneport for $100.  that is less cost than a good pedal!  then record bass and guitar.  make a ton of descent songs, then recruit musicians out of that.  

put in your craigslist ad "NO ILLEGAL DRUGS! NO FLAKES!"  this stops a lot of junkie flake types that commit to a practice then cancel last minute from contacting you.  music should be about music, if you cant find legit musicians then it is time to move or start recording songs.

I have a decent recording setup, and whatnot, the problem is... when I sit down in front of it... nothing comes anymore, it's like all of the riffs are gone, or something.



^^^^ this is pretty much what it yields.



^^^^ I'm sure most of you have heard these, because I'm sure I've posted them before, but I'm not really a stranger to doin' it alone, I just... can't do it anymore? Feels so foreign to me, at this point.

Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: johnny problem on June 24, 2012, 01:25:49 PM
Maybe you're approach isn't the best?  I know that solo artists, Brant Bjork for example, when recording Jalamanta, would lay down the drum tracks first and then add bass and guitar.  This might be the reason you're having difficulty adding drums to your guitar riffs.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 24, 2012, 01:28:22 PM
Quote from: johnny problem on June 24, 2012, 01:25:49 PM
Maybe you're approach isn't the best?  I know that solo artists, Brant Bjork for example, when recording Jalamanta, would lay down the drum tracks first and then add bass and guitar.  This might be the reason you're having difficulty adding drums to your guitar riffs.

I saw that when I was watching the retrospective thingy, he had to write the songs beforehand, surely.. I'm roadblocked at the first step, lacking inspiration, I guess...

Maybe the new Om will help me, and i'll put out a crusher fuzzed out bass jam.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: dunwichamps on June 24, 2012, 01:52:40 PM
Seriously move to ct alreadyy
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: everdrone on June 24, 2012, 04:35:12 PM
as you know, this type of music and most live music is stuff you cant make a living on.  Wino, Phil Amselmo, Matt Pike are very famous and have generated tons of albums and did many live shows and are quoted saying they cant afford to make payments on their home and stuff, see movie at 1hour and 5 minutes to 1hour and 10 minutes:



so before you move, consider this is only a hobbie!  you seem to be open to trying other styles, way more styles then me, I wont play any music that does not downtune to c# or lower. one thing to do is stop playing any guitar/bass for 2 months, then get netflix membership and rent a lot of practice video tutorials and expand your playing abilities. cheers!!   ;D
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: everdrone on June 24, 2012, 04:36:49 PM
doublepost
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: dunwichamps on June 24, 2012, 04:42:17 PM
I was jesting jake it's equally crappy here so I just build instead
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: everdrone on June 24, 2012, 04:55:56 PM
I moved to Austin TX thinking it would be better but it really was not...really hard to get a bar gig much less get a paying gig. they want to know how many people you can bring to drink, kinda like the pay to play places I was at when I lived in Orange County CA. in Austin there are a zillion musicians and even the really great original bands only play like once every 3 months. cover bands are a different story however...  you can get gigs as a cover band as Danny G will testify to, I saw his shows and they work in covers. in San Antonio, cover bands really bring in their own crowd, and the dive bar goers that go to see live music without knowing the band are a sparse crowd...
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Lumpy on June 24, 2012, 06:30:20 PM
Write songs now/work on your vocals. It takes a long time to get good at that, so start now. When you have the songs ready, you're most of the way there.

What if you were surrounded by great musicians right now, what would you say? "Lets just jam around, and hope something happens"? Or would it be better to say "these are my songs".
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: mutantcolors on June 24, 2012, 11:05:43 PM
I don't mean to semi-brag on my own shit or spam the whole jam room but I went solo and couldn't be happier. Just do everything.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: liquidsmoke on June 24, 2012, 11:45:30 PM
Quote from: everdrone on June 24, 2012, 04:35:12 PM
one thing to do is stop playing any guitar/bass for 2 months

I highly recommend this. Or longer even. Maybe also stop listening to stuff that sounds similar to the stuff you play as well.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Discö Rice on June 25, 2012, 01:14:18 AM
Instead of playing with a drum machine, you could come to Brooklyn and play with a drumming machine ! (*flexes muscles in hypnotic manner)
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 25, 2012, 01:27:42 AM
Quote from: Discö Rice on June 25, 2012, 01:14:18 AM
Instead of playing with a drum machine, you could come to Brooklyn and play with a drumming machine ! (*flexes muscles in hypnotic manner)

Would be fun as hell! a 36 inch deep kick drum... mmm....
Title: Re: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Discö Rice on June 25, 2012, 02:32:19 AM
Fuck yes it would be.  :)
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: moose23 on June 25, 2012, 04:55:13 AM
Lumpy's answers seem to be spot on. What age are you?
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: mawso on June 25, 2012, 08:22:53 AM
can't you write by playing along with the drums in your head?

i can't play drums, or even really program them very well, so that's how i've written most everything
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: ryansummit on June 25, 2012, 08:41:54 AM
I've moved so many times in the past 15 years searchin for this or that, and ended up in some college towns that got pretty lame after a while. what i did notice there was always an older dude, that younger people had a stupid nickname for, that seemed to be stuck in that town,friends all gone, crappy job or on disability,only comes out right before the liquor store closes.

#1.try not to end up feeling stuck like him(move where a friend is if you have to,sometimes its awesome,some not so)
#2. ask that dude to jam, he always ends up rippin it on something,just hasnt been asked in 10 years
#3.move to the country to be a hermit only as last resort,after you're 37,someone somewhere needs those riffs
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Pundan on June 25, 2012, 10:28:14 AM
I've been in your shoes. One might recalled that I had a topic about our old drummer, we sacked him and found a new one. We have to travel 2½ hours (one-way) just to jam with our drummer.
I'd rather sit in a car for 2½ hours instead of jamming with an asshole. So try to find someone farther away from you.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: AgentofOblivion on June 25, 2012, 12:36:45 PM
This isn't exactly what you were looking for, but maybe it will help.  Tips for getting out of a writing rut:

-  Dial in a completely different tone than you're used to.  If you typically play bass heavy, dial in some presence.  If you play bright, roll the tone knob down.  Cut some gain.  I play differently depending on the tone.  If you always use a pick, try playing with fingers.
-  Set the mood with lighting.  It sounds stupid, but it works.  If you can dim all the lights and maybe put a visualization on a TV screen while jamming, it tends to help that mind frame.  It might take 10 or 15 minutes, but droning stoner rock shit is hard to make if you're in a well lit living room next to a floral print sofa.  Mood has a big affect.
-  Don't go in with the mindset that you're going to write a cool tune.  Just noodle around.  If you're playing something that sucks, see if you can just improve it but without having the goal of using it for something.  If it sucks enough that it's pissing you off, play a cover tune that's badass.  If you're not being productive either learning how to improve something or creating something cool, then just make sure you play something you already know that sounds good or you'll get burned out.  After all, playing should be fun, not just work.
-  Learn a song from a band you've always liked but never have taken the time to learn before.  Pick something that has a style or vibe that is missing from your playing.  Try to figure out what it is about that riff that possesses the qualities you don't have.  Then try to write a riff that completely rips off that song.  Attempt to capture its vibe that made it unique or different from what you usually play. 
-  Take breaks from playing.  Sometimes it just helps to not play for a week or two.  The fingers take awhile to get flowing again, but that Pantera riff you've played a billion times always sounds a bit fresher and groovier when you plug in for the first couple times and let it rip.

The creative juices are not always flowing.  In those times you should use the time to tinker and enjoy.  Add more tools to the toolbox so you'll have something new to try when the juices are there.  Also, those new tools often lead to new riffs because they give you a mental focus.  Instead of sitting down, staring at a blank page, you have that first paragraph.  And ironically enough, that's where the unique shit comes from.  Sure, you won't use the riffs that directly rip off Brad Paisley or the Melvins.  But later on when you play that gnarly Melvins riff with chicken-pickin on some middle eastern scale, you'll be thankful the juices stopped flowing long enough for you to learn some new shit.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: xayk on June 25, 2012, 02:28:03 PM
I want to get a set of the Oblique Strategies cards: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oblique_Strategies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oblique_Strategies).  There's a few websites that list them, too, but I'm a sucker for the tangible.  Sometimes I feel like a musical rut is indicative of whatever else may also be wrong with my life, so I like the idea of a third-party as a guiding hand on occasion. And why not let that hand be Brian Eno?
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Discö Rice on June 25, 2012, 03:20:15 PM
Quote from: xayk on June 25, 2012, 02:28:03 PM
I want to get a set of the Oblique Strategies cards: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oblique_Strategies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oblique_Strategies).  There's a few websites that list them, too, but I'm a sucker for the tangible.  Sometimes I feel like a musical rut is indicative of whatever else may also be wrong with my life, so I like the idea of a third-party as a guiding hand on occasion. And why not let that hand be Brian Eno?

Wow! That was my first introduction to Oblique Strategies. Very cool stuff. Will come in handy.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: clockwork green on June 25, 2012, 03:42:04 PM
One of the things I've noticed with my noodling lately is that for the first 20-30 minutes I just sit there playing old, recycled riffs or dialing in tones.  I'm not doing this consciously but it just seems to happen. Around this point I start to get bored and frustrated that I can't think of anything interesting.  Many times I'll just put down the guitar and go do something else but I've found that lately if I push through this imaginary wall at around 30 minutes and keep going, that's when the riffs start happening.  I record a lot of riffs on my phone and then dictate them in a tab like way on there so I won't forget them and I notice this trend of me coming up for 4 or 5 riffs I really like all in a bunch and all about 30 or so minutes after I start noodling.  When I have down time and take the BART train to work I'll listen to the old riffs and make notes on them for later songwriting so I know which riff is a slow doomy one and which one is a aggressive metal riff or a quiet clean thing.  It's really streamlined my writing.  The other day I also used a chord dictionary app on my phone to just try a ton of different chords and I used that to come up with a new riff on a song I've been stuck on for 6-months and I really like it.  I've done the same thing with scales before to help with phrasing or just to look at a giant scale mapped out on a guitar and make my own chords up from there. 
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: fallen on June 25, 2012, 10:06:35 PM
I need to build a shower guitar / recorder. I always seem to get song ideas in there. Must be the water droning in Db or B.

Or maybe I need to buy one of those Indian drone machines like Om has.

Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: EddieMullet on June 26, 2012, 10:23:19 AM
When you're dead.

Look at Jason Becker, he can't do anything but move his eyes due to ALS and he's still making music.

Noodling about on a keyboard sometimes works even a cheap ass Casio, find an random beat, a cool sound and just start hitting keys.

Learn random covers turn on the oldies station and learn the first song you hear.  If its some old Motown or Stax tune there's a lot of knowledge in those old tunes.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on June 26, 2012, 11:32:28 AM
Quote from: clockwork green on June 25, 2012, 03:42:04 PM
One of the things I've noticed with my noodling lately is that for the first 20-30 minutes I just sit there playing old, recycled riffs or dialing in tones.  I'm not doing this consciously but it just seems to happen. Around this point I start to get bored and frustrated that I can't think of anything interesting.  Many times I'll just put down the guitar and go do something else but I've found that lately if I push through this imaginary wall at around 30 minutes and keep going, that's when the riffs start happening.  I record a lot of riffs on my phone and then dictate them in a tab like way on there so I won't forget them and I notice this trend of me coming up for 4 or 5 riffs I really like all in a bunch and all about 30 or so minutes after I start noodling.  When I have down time and take the BART train to work I'll listen to the old riffs and make notes on them for later songwriting so I know which riff is a slow doomy one and which one is a aggressive metal riff or a quiet clean thing.  It's really streamlined my writing.  The other day I also used a chord dictionary app on my phone to just try a ton of different chords and I used that to come up with a new riff on a song I've been stuck on for 6-months and I really like it.  I've done the same thing with scales before to help with phrasing or just to look at a giant scale mapped out on a guitar and make my own chords up from there. 

I never break out of the "rut box" that you're talking about, in the first 30. It's so disparaging, sometimes.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: RacerX on June 26, 2012, 11:40:29 AM
Did I tell you you could come outta yer room yet?

No?

I didn't think so.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: JemDooM on July 03, 2012, 07:25:13 AM
Sunn I really like your stuff!

Musically iv been almost completely solitary, not through choice, I really have tried. Personally I find it to be a hard and slow process to write/record alone. Iv played with others in the past and its been a great feeling to create music with people that you have a connection with and its so much easier to write when you have other living breathing souls to bounce off each other. I know exactly how lonely it can feel going it alone. Whenever I feel frustrated or down in any way musically I remind myself that those feelings come from passion, its a positive source, and if the passion is there then its essential that you keep on going.....
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Czernobog on July 03, 2012, 10:08:37 AM
Stop trying at all to accomplish anything.  Just play, or don't play.  Everything else is superfluous and gets in the way of the music.  Things will flow naturally from there when time is right.

Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: tossom on July 03, 2012, 02:49:03 PM
I have quit for a 2nd time at 28.  I burnt out on music at 22 and didn't play, or even listen to much for about 3 years.  Was asked for a jam with a band at 26, started playing again and did 1 gig that went pretty well plus we were starting to write some cool stuff.  Then I had a knee operation and in the time it took for me to get back on my feet the bassist and drummer had found different bands.

Don't think there is any realistic chance of me being in a band again in the near future so my guitars are just nice looking ornaments I pick up now and then.  The only music scenes where I live is folk, which I really am not into, whiteman blues covers and or rock covers (which I am not at all into either).  Would rather not play at all than be playing "Highway to Hell" or "Crossroads" again.  Chances of finding other people who are open to writing or playing heavy original music here is nil so back to just listening to music.  I don't see the point in keeping on writing or practising.

But I got kick ass wireless headphones so I can listen betterer 8)
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Lumpy on July 03, 2012, 07:00:06 PM
Quote from: tossom on July 03, 2012, 02:49:03 PMI don't see the point in keeping on writing or practising.


Music should be a life-long activity IMO. When you're 70, you want to be able to sit on your back porch and entertain yourself with some tunes. If you are a killer player due to years of practice, it will be even more fun.

I hate the idea that playing music is only about being in a popular band.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: clockwork green on July 03, 2012, 07:10:31 PM
Quote from: fallen on June 25, 2012, 10:06:35 PM
I need to build a shower guitar / recorder. I always seem to get song ideas in there. Must be the water droning in Db or B.

Or maybe I need to buy one of those Indian drone machines like Om has.


There's a really cool iPhone app called iTanpura that does a ton of different Indian drones. It's a little pricey for apps but it does a great job and is highly tweakable.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: RacerX on July 03, 2012, 07:15:45 PM
First serious post outta me in this thread:

I agree with Lumpy.

I'm over 50, and I make music primarily for my own enjoyment. Sure, I like playing out, playing with others, writing songs & recording them, but many of my most enjoyable musical moments have been playing alone, without an agenda, with no one listening & no recorded evidence they ever happened.

Playing should be fun if you're doing it right. I'm still having fun.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Submarine on July 03, 2012, 07:41:27 PM
I quit being a musician when being an audio engineer became profitable.  Tomorrow I start my first lesson in classical guitar and I am very excited, I have been promising this to myself for far too long and its finally going to happen. If I can play a few pieces with half the technique I had when I had my rock chops I will be very pleased.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: dogfood on July 03, 2012, 09:02:41 PM
Sunn, I've found the music comes and goes.  I've also found that it comes back which is the most important thing.  It will return.  You remind me of ....

This one a long time have I watched. All his life has he looked away... to the future, to the horizon. Never his mind on where he was. Hmm? What he was doing. Hmph. Adventure. Heh. Excitement. Heh. A Jedi craves not these things.

Leave the house, get laid!
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: neighbor664 on July 04, 2012, 11:42:07 AM
I am in agreement with Lumpy and Racer.
An analogy of music (and your relationship with it) being much like food is something that resonates with me.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: mortlock on July 05, 2012, 11:57:18 PM
energy food..
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: clockwork green on July 06, 2012, 05:16:13 AM
I was re-reading this thread the other day when it struck me that one of the reasons I hate going to our studio and working on songs by myself is the terrible lighting (thanks Agents for the reminder).  I changed a few bulbs out to green and turned off the overhead fluorescents and it's just a much more comfortable and productive place to be.  I use my phone to record new riffs and arrangements and usually if I have a good day of writing I'll have 3 new clips but the day I changed the lights I had 8.  It's amazing how something so simple and obvious can still make such a big difference.  I guess the take home message is that a shitty writing day isn't usually that far from a great writing day...it just takes something to get the ball rolling. 
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Worthless Willie on July 10, 2012, 11:42:09 PM
White light is a Creativity Crusher, IMO.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Harm on July 11, 2012, 02:52:59 AM
Since the problem isn't people not wanting to jam with you reading this topic, it is merely the distance between musicians. So you should probably focus on solving that. Obviously you don't want to move, so perhaps you could try to form a band through the internet. Maybe you can jam through skype and record what the other is doing.

And quiting? I am way too far to turn back.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: clockwork green on July 11, 2012, 03:50:03 AM
Jesus, we're going through a new one.  So my the bass player from my old band and I have been trying to start a new project but have had drummer issues.  We found a great drummer but he was in too many bands and just way over-committed to work out.  Then a few weeks ago we found another really good drummer but he's a package deal with his girlfriend the singer.  That seemd to be fine but now they're awol and she pulled a weird thing by taking an hour long business call last practice and never showing back up...he had to take her mic and meet her in the car. I'm not asking for John Bonham, I'm not asking for someone to drop their life, just jam whenever they can.  I feel like I'd almost feel better just giving up on others rather than having these promising starts and stops.  I guess the moral of the story for me is to always have something going on for myself because I just can't trust others (except the bass player, he's been there for nearly 11 years).
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: VOLVO))) on July 27, 2012, 05:53:57 PM
Shit, it's happening again. I just spent a couple hours with a bunch of really, really awesome musicians and I feel like a total fucking scrub. I suck compared to all of these dudes... I know you're supposed to hang with dudes who are better so you progress, but these dudes just made me feel like a fucking loser, without even saying a goddamn word about me...
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: the diddler on July 27, 2012, 06:22:06 PM
Quote from: SunnO))) on July 27, 2012, 05:53:57 PM
Shit, it's happening again. I just spent a couple hours with a bunch of really, really awesome musicians and I feel like a total fucking scrub. I suck compared to all of these dudes... I know you're supposed to hang with dudes who are better so you progress, but these dudes just made me feel like a fucking loser, without even saying a goddamn word about me...

guaranteed you can do/know shit that is out of their realm of experience.  bring your shit to the table and if it doesn't mesh with their shit, the shitfeast wasn't meant to happen. but, on the other hand, if they're looking down their pro-hair pro-gear noses at you, burn their houses down and shit on their moms.   
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: The Shocker on July 27, 2012, 07:22:58 PM
Quote from: the diddler on July 27, 2012, 06:22:06 PM
Quote from: SunnO))) on July 27, 2012, 05:53:57 PM
Shit, it's happening again. I just spent a couple hours with a bunch of really, really awesome musicians and I feel like a total fucking scrub. I suck compared to all of these dudes... I know you're supposed to hang with dudes who are better so you progress, but these dudes just made me feel like a fucking loser, without even saying a goddamn word about me...

guaranteed you can do/know shit that is out of their realm of experience.  bring your shit to the table and if it doesn't mesh with their shit, the shitfeast wasn't meant to happen. but, on the other hand, if they're looking down their pro-hair pro-gear noses at you, burn their houses down and shit on their moms.   

Right on!
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: liquidsmoke on July 27, 2012, 08:21:31 PM
No quitting!

I'm just saying that because writing music makes me feel high and love life.

If you're playing with some dudes who are way better than you then play rhythm guitar or torture yourself trying to write bass lines to their parts. That's all I got.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: everdrone on July 27, 2012, 10:01:19 PM
you can always work on your own stuff and rent a lot of netflix how to play different styles videos for guitar :)


dont be closed minded to other styles of music

also, read cool books about music http://www.amazon.com/Zen-Guitar-Philip-Toshio-Sudo/dp/068483877X
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: moose23 on July 28, 2012, 08:07:01 AM
I'd much rather be the weakest player in the room than the best.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: everdrone on July 28, 2012, 11:09:43 AM
Quote from: moose23 on July 28, 2012, 08:07:01 AM
I'd much rather be the weakest player in the room than the best.

ya, not a good feeling to be the best if its because the others are really weak... 
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: RacerX on August 04, 2012, 03:25:39 PM
"When is time to quit?"

http://riffrocklives.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=19;sa=showPosts


July 31, 2012?
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: I,Galactus on August 04, 2012, 04:27:45 PM
Quote from: RacerX on August 04, 2012, 03:25:39 PM
"When is time to quit?"

http://riffrocklives.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=19;sa=showPosts


July 31, 2012?

Apparently.  :(
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: clockwork green on August 04, 2012, 05:46:06 PM
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: jibberish on August 06, 2012, 02:16:40 AM
Quote from: Lumpy on July 03, 2012, 07:00:06 PM
Quote from: tossom on July 03, 2012, 02:49:03 PMI don't see the point in keeping on writing or practising.


Music should be a life-long activity IMO. When you're 70, you want to be able to sit on your back porch and entertain yourself with some tunes. If you are a killer player due to years of practice, it will be even more fun.

I hate the idea that playing music is only about being in a popular band.

^this is thee key to it all
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: tombhex on August 06, 2012, 09:57:07 AM
Quote from: SunnO))) on July 27, 2012, 05:53:57 PM
Shit, it's happening again. I just spent a couple hours with a bunch of really, really awesome musicians and I feel like a total fucking scrub. I suck compared to all of these dudes... I know you're supposed to hang with dudes who are better so you progress, but these dudes just made me feel like a fucking loser, without even saying a goddamn word about me...

this is how i feel every time i get out and jam with some great musicians. it's just a reminder of exactly how tight my playing used to be and of the fact that i just don't have the drive to hone my skills again or get better at guitar.

i know a lot of people say that your mid-twenties are that period of constant growth and a great time to get into and experience a bunch of things and play a bunch of places "before it's too late" (job, wife, kids, parents getting older, etc) but i feel like for the most part my twenties have provided me with little more than a whole lot of listlessness.

the most debilitating blow to my drive to get out and meet people to play music with or start a new band is realizing that i'm not the musician i once was and haven't done anything to make the situation any better.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Stonergrunge on August 22, 2012, 10:30:19 PM
When is time to quit?

When you're dead.
Title: Re: When is time to quit?
Post by: Lumpy on August 23, 2012, 03:48:59 AM
Quote from: tombhex on August 06, 2012, 09:57:07 AM
Quote from: SunnO))) on July 27, 2012, 05:53:57 PM
Shit, it's happening again. I just spent a couple hours with a bunch of really, really awesome musicians and I feel like a total fucking scrub. I suck compared to all of these dudes... I know you're supposed to hang with dudes who are better so you progress, but these dudes just made me feel like a fucking loser, without even saying a goddamn word about me...

this is how i feel every time i get out and jam with some great musicians. it's just a reminder of exactly how tight my playing used to be and of the fact that i just don't have the drive to hone my skills again or get better at guitar.

i know a lot of people say that your mid-twenties are that period of constant growth and a great time to get into and experience a bunch of things and play a bunch of places "before it's too late" (job, wife, kids, parents getting older, etc) but i feel like for the most part my twenties have provided me with little more than a whole lot of listlessness.

the most debilitating blow to my drive to get out and meet people to play music with or start a new band is realizing that i'm not the musician i once was and haven't done anything to make the situation any better.

You gotta keep your chops up, so if you do meet some serious dudes, you're ready like Freddy.

If you only practice when you feel like it, then you're just not that serious (says a dude who only practices when he feels like it). Nothing wrong with that, as long as that matches up to your aspirations. I'm into playing music for fun (because there's no way in hell I could do it professionally).