Wanna blow yer minds? Check it out (Chovied, I know you're gonna dig this)...
I knew it, the fart chair is the secret!
Car speakers is interesting. I know the car door speaker in the Gorilla amp Sonance guitarist writes with really aids its icepick to the ear quality. AIDS being the operative term.
Robert Randolph is a monster.
Have watched it several times trying to cop some of his VP and wah technique but cant even get close.
another ten year of practice maybe.
I wish he had demo-ed some of the effects he didnt, like the pog 2 and dynamic filter(auto wah)
good vid tho.
I've been diggin' on this for a long while. I really dig his sounds.
Quote from: Chovie D on January 22, 2012, 11:46:53 AM
Have watched it several times trying to cop some of his VP and wah technique but cant even get close.
another ten year of practice maybe.
I wish he had demo-ed some of the effects he didnt, like the pog 2 and dynamic filter(auto wah)
good vid tho.
I've already started rolling the bar back & forth on the lap steel when I want a tighter, more controlled vibrato. It never occurred to me to do anything but move the whole bar back & forth. I also see that I'm not the first to set up my lap steel in open C.
Good pedal steel players make the rest of us "regular" guitarists look pedestrian and Robert Randolph is one of the best. Good to see a pro like him still having fun.
Quote from: clockwork green on January 22, 2012, 04:05:55 PM
Good pedal steel players make the rest of us "regular" guitarists look pedestrian and Robert Randolph is one of the best. Good to see a pro like him still having fun.
Amen!
Dude is a total monster player. Got that attitude too. i would bet the car speaker stuff is pure hoax. I love that stuff.
I haven't watched the clip but I agree he's fantastic..
At least watch far enough to try to wrap your brain around how he's got that 13-string tuned.
Amazing. He's got bits & pieces of all sorts of chord variations on that fucker.
Quote from: RacerX on January 22, 2012, 01:06:04 PM
Quote from: Chovie D on January 22, 2012, 11:46:53 AM
Have watched it several times trying to cop some of his VP and wah technique but cant even get close.
another ten year of practice maybe.
I wish he had demo-ed some of the effects he didnt, like the pog 2 and dynamic filter(auto wah)
good vid tho.
I've already started rolling the bar back & forth on the lap steel when I want a tighter, more controlled vibrato. It never occurred to me to do anything but move the whole bar back & forth. I also see that I'm not the first to set up my lap steel in open C.
Open tunings on lap are really common racer. These sacred steel players have such a great tone and amazing fluidity in their bar hands. They've been playing since they were kids in church so its not surprising how natural it seems to come for them. RR learned from the campbell brothers...heres a quick lesson racer. dig the left hand.
Derek Trucks has been using car speakers for a long time.
funny you mention Trucks. He is into sacred steel and uses alot of their techniques, jams with em, etc. he has that same fluid sound in his left hand, im so jealous of it...dig this incredible solo...
I straight up cannot play slide standing up. I play over the top, because I'm undisciplined and learned with it on my lap, and for some reason, no matter what strap I use, or how I position it, fuckin' things ALWAYS neck dive. hate it.
Quote from: Chovie D on January 22, 2012, 06:44:47 PM
Quote from: RacerX on January 22, 2012, 01:06:04 PM
Quote from: Chovie D on January 22, 2012, 11:46:53 AM
Have watched it several times trying to cop some of his VP and wah technique but cant even get close.
another ten year of practice maybe.
I wish he had demo-ed some of the effects he didnt, like the pog 2 and dynamic filter(auto wah)
good vid tho.
I've already started rolling the bar back & forth on the lap steel when I want a tighter, more controlled vibrato. It never occurred to me to do anything but move the whole bar back & forth. I also see that I'm not the first to set up my lap steel in open C.
Open tunings on lap are really common racer. These sacred steel players have such a great tone and amazing fluidity in their bar hands. They've been playing since they were kids in church so its not surprising how natural it seems to come for them. RR learned from the campbell brothers...heres a quick lesson racer. dig the left hand.
Nice. There's another stupidly simple idea that I wouldn't have come up with myself: just lift the bar to stop the stings w/the left hand. Coming from regular guitar, muting with the right hand has always been my "go to" method.
Tell ya what, Chovied—I've gotten this far on lap steel without lessons, but I can see where they might turn on a few more lightbulbs in my attic. That said, I can now play Gilmour's lap steel solo from "Shine on You Crazy Diamond" and rock the hell outta "When the Levee Breaks," so I'm getting a bit more fluent.
Quote from: RacerX on January 23, 2012, 12:46:16 PM
Quote from: Chovie D on January 22, 2012, 06:44:47 PM
Quote from: RacerX on January 22, 2012, 01:06:04 PM
Quote from: Chovie D on January 22, 2012, 11:46:53 AM
Have watched it several times trying to cop some of his VP and wah technique but cant even get close.
another ten year of practice maybe.
I wish he had demo-ed some of the effects he didnt, like the pog 2 and dynamic filter(auto wah)
good vid tho.
I've already started rolling the bar back & forth on the lap steel when I want a tighter, more controlled vibrato. It never occurred to me to do anything but move the whole bar back & forth. I also see that I'm not the first to set up my lap steel in open C.
Open tunings on lap are really common racer. These sacred steel players have such a great tone and amazing fluidity in their bar hands. They've been playing since they were kids in church so its not surprising how natural it seems to come for them. RR learned from the campbell brothers...heres a quick lesson racer. dig the left hand.
Nice. There's another stupidly simple idea that I wouldn't have come up with myself: just lift the bar to stop the stings w/the left hand. Coming from regular guitar, muting with the right hand has always been my "go to" method.
Tell ya what, Chovied—I've gotten this far on lap steel without lessons, but I can see where they might turn on a few more lightbulbs in my attic. That said, I can now play Gilmour's lap steel solo from "Shine on You Crazy Diamond" and rock the hell outta "When the Levee Breaks," so I'm getting a bit more fluent.
I dont think there's any harm in youtubing up a couple quick lessons , especially regarding technique. Using a bar and fingerpicks is very different than a regular fretted instrument so theres gonna be alot of useful technique you wouldnt necessarily think of on your own coming from guitar. For lap steel , since there are so many stylistic variations, its also a great idea ot check ut big name players in differnt styles. For rock, David Lindley is one of the best, Sacred Steel or blues =Campbell bros, Chuck Campbell is amazing, for country Cindy Cashdollar, Hawaiian=Jerry Byrd. Jerry Byrd is probably the most estemmed lap player ever, I cant stand his music tho.
Stones albums are great to jam to, AL perkins and Ry Cooder do some ghreat stuff with the stones from the Mick taylor period and beyond.
If I may be so bold as to suggest anothe techinique to pay attention to, one of the other things to take away from that vid I posted is, on lap steel in a blues or sacred steel style(rock basically), you often just play one string up and down as opposed to using multiple strings across the neck. Try playing melody lines up and down on just one string. Stuff like "amazing grace" or "when the saints come marching in", as corny as they are work great for practice. The idea is that you are learning to play a melody line, then you can add expressive flair to it, do it any song with a melody line. Its a beautiful way of playing steel. So often I'll just repeat the melody line of the singer, nothing more, and people weep :'(. Also you dont have to alternate your picking fingers when doing this. Use whichever finger (or thumb) is your strongest finger picker. You'll notice the cat in the vid uses his pointer...dobro players will use their thumb...whatever's strongest.
good luck Racer, theres a shit ton of info out there on the net, gobs of tab, might as well give it a peek. ;)
man, these guys blow me away. y'all are onto something really slick here. rock on.
Quote from: SunnO))) on January 22, 2012, 07:10:38 PM
I straight up cannot play slide standing up. I play over the top, because I'm undisciplined and learned with it on my lap, and for some reason, no matter what strap I use, or how I position it, fuckin' things ALWAYS neck dive. hate it.
nothin wrong with playing over the top.
Im happy we have so many players here. Its kinda awesome.
Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk
I liked this vid...hammerons and pulloffs are cool on a steel. i havent been able to get pinch harmonics down using fingerpicks yet...this guys got it goin on
I modded all my thumb picks to be really shallow, so i could still use the meat of my thumb, he's doing literal pinch harmonics. Using the thumb to pick the note, and pulling out the artificial harmonic with his index. I can do them with just fingers, it' like snapping your fingers, but slightly more refined, if that makes any sense?
Woh! Dude's fast.
I found I couldn't deal w/ the thumb pick, so I already have the pinch harmonics down because I get 'em the same way I do on guitar: I use a flat pick between the thumb & forefinger and follow with the meat of my thumb. For the lap steel, I add two fingerpicks (middle/ring fingers).
I have been working on the single string stuff a lot lately when practicing along with tunes/backing tracks. I've always had a pretty good ear, but that kinda shit really puts it to the test.
Two other important things I have learned:
1) Vibrato is my friend
2) A bit flat doesn't sound too bad, but even a smidge sharp sounds like ass. Refer to #1.
I can't use the picks on any other fingers other than my thumb. I need to feel to keep the dynamics. I've got sausage fingers, but I can do dainty things with them. hahaha.
Hm. You using a plastic or a metal thumb pick?
I switch depending on the tone I want.
How exactly did you mod the picks?
Pics? ;)
I may give it a try.
When I play guitar, I have a really shallow hold on my pick, just enough to keep my fingers clear of the strings. It comes from playing death metal and shit, lots of speed picking and pinch harmonics. I just grind 'em down so there's less... pick. Less pick = less drag = less friction = less force exerted...
yeah that dudes got speed, but if you take even one of those hammeron licks and use it by itself? you'll have something resembling a chop ;)
I made the decision to go with finger/thumbpicks right off the bat. It was/is one of the most difficult things for me to get used to, sometimes I feel like I got boxing gloves on..no control or finess and it gets WAY qworse after two beers for some reason, but there is a tone you get from picks, and also certain alternate picking techinique's where its required for speed.
The only well known player I can think of who doesnt use picks is Daniel Lanois.
whatever works for ya tho.
Pinch harmonics when your fingers are all wearing picks is a somewhat different beast..theres a coupe of ways to do it, including the "snapping" method Sunn))))) Mentioned.
I've got hard tips if you know what I mean...
I remembered a couple other no pick players.
Steve Cunningham
on steel pedal steel Lanois plays with no picks at all, very unorthodox style and tuning, beautiful tho
and of course Junior Brown, but he plays guitar and steel in the same song ...he uses a flatpick between thumb and finger like all guitarists do, but also has some finger picks on middle and ring it looks like. He must have a 6th tuning on his steel, sounds very western swingish.
point is you can do whatever you want. Id suggest tryin the picks tho, they are cheap and you can decide then if your missing something by not having em on. They allow me to play wide harmony grips and they do increase speed when your doing the clawhammerish or dobroish stuff. Theres a reason banjo pickers use em :)
I've always had trouble using finger/thumb pics. I tend to play either with a standard pick or with none at all.
No pick seems pretty natural to me. Maybe it's my love of Jeff Beck. Maybe it's having some foundation in classical guitar (no nails) and and bass? I've always been in awe of the picking techniques of Flamenco players too and I figure there has to be some middle ground between all the different techniques. That being said, there is a certain tone that is hard to attain with out finger picks.
yeah i really enjoy fingerpicking on guitar and played classical guitar as a kid. I recently bought a nylon string and I love to fingerpick on that. i cant do it on steel tho, Im used to the picks now.
Andy from PGS plays pickless and he gets pretty much all great tones. I tried out the finger picks just now, and I play really loud, and almost without dynamics at this point, with them. If I'm playing acoustic, I'm not really playing what I normally do. Think more of a mellow math-rock band, as gay as that is. Something touches me about really intricate pretty guitar parts that sound like 2 or 3 guitars, but it's only one.
I didnt see the steel in that clip ???
yeah tons more volume with picks. the attack is just different. Sharp, more percussive. sometimes (alot of the times for country steel) you want that snappy sound.
I still fumble with the picks, i get em caught in the strings, they fly off, I miss strings or grab the wrong one...and this is after 5 years of practice every day >:(
after a couple beers i get what i call the LOBSTER CLAW. Right hand has no control and feels like a clumsy pincer :D
shit.... I better get in some practice b4 work.*pops on picks
*pops off picks.
One thing I should add aboot fingerpicks. you have to shape them with a pair of needlenose pliers, you cannot just slap em on straight oot the box and expect them to be useable. Some people shape em so teh tip sticks way oot, some so that the tip is close to the fingertip. be sure you got em on the right way too. I ptake a small bandaid and wrap it around the parts that hug your cuticle. This keeps the picks from slipping off your fingers , keeps em snug, and prevent cuticle irritation. This aint my hand but its close ot how I have my picks shaped...I leave a little more length sticking out from the fingertip.
(http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/userpix0903/7145_Finger_Picks_1.jpg)
Don't know if you've seen this....
http://guitarz.blogspot.com/2010/07/john-paul-joness-manson-custom-bass.html
Quote from: inductorguitars on January 24, 2012, 03:27:45 PM
Don't know if you've seen this....
http://guitarz.blogspot.com/2010/07/john-paul-joness-manson-custom-bass.html
I didnt know JPJ played steel. There is some pedal steel on zeppelin 3 but its Jimmy Page.
I see those melobar guitars for sale from time to time, bout $700 or so. There was one at a local shop a while back and the body was like this foam rubbery stuff. It was really weird. They are sort of like keytars.
Peavey tried something similar a few years back. I dont think it as well received, Ive never seen one IRL.
I saw John Paul Jones play a solo show a few years back. 1, it was heavy has hell, he's got some super cool basses 10-string stuff and he plays some really heavy riffs. 2, he played a lot of Zeppelin songs on pedal steel and made them way more bad ass then any cover band I've ever seen.
Looks big enough to be a pedal steel, but...
Great clip. leave it to the guy named RacerX to post a clip with Paul Gilbert. ;)
well, hes no david lindley...but he's better than Page ;)
anyone here could be playing like that in a couple months
he's just doin the single string and hammer-on stuff we've been talking about, cept he doesnt have that fluid vocal quality that a Randolph, Campbell, Lindley or Trucks has. Sorry for the critique, he sounds great, and Im no better at it than he is.
btw the WORST steel player Ive seen in a big band situation is Ronnie Wood, egads..and hes been "playing" for over 25 years!
Pages pedal steel on songs like "Thats the Way" is charmingly bad..."hit chord..mash pedals"..but it still works. Im a rank amatuer myself so ...not much better. :(
Looks like a custom made 8 string lap steel with a palm bender on the 3rd string, on a keyboard stand.
Quote from: RacerX on January 24, 2012, 10:52:16 PM
Looks big enough to be a pedal steel, but...
Wait what bass is that? 4003 with a P-pass pickup?
Quote from: inductorguitars on January 25, 2012, 12:44:48 PM
Quote from: RacerX on January 24, 2012, 10:52:16 PM
Looks big enough to be a pedal steel, but...
Wait what bass is that? 4003 with a P-pass pickup?
Think is 4000, dude is Linus of Hollywood (provided I recognise him purely from the bass correctly) and there's a bunch of discussion about that bass under the topic of the video for Scarified on various forums.
It is indeed Linus of Hollywood, It's a 4000 with Pbass pickupssss.
I've seen at least a couple other guys with P pickups in Ric's/copies. The dude form Earthless and the one dude from BB & the Bros immediately come to mind. Never really understood it but w/e floats.
Keep eying this rick copy armed with a P pickup. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/150740177866?ssPageName=STRK:MEBOFFX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1432.l2649
My favourite thing is the screwdriver in the strap button, but I basically hate the shape of Ricks and only like fake ones because they seems to personally massively wind up John Hall.
Quote from: RacerX on January 24, 2012, 10:52:16 PM
Looks big enough to be a pedal steel, but...
Did Gilbert just come from his other gig...working at an airport?
Mebbe fighter pilot?
Quote from: Chovie D on January 25, 2012, 12:12:06 PM
well, hes no david lindley...but he's better than Page ;)
anyone here could be playing like that in a couple months
he's just doin the single string and hammer-on stuff we've been talking about, cept he doesnt have that fluid vocal quality that a Randolph, Campbell, Lindley or Trucks has. Sorry for the critique, he sounds great, and Im no better at it than he is.
btw the WORST steel player Ive seen in a big band situation is Ronnie Wood, egads..and hes been "playing" for over 25 years!
Pages pedal steel on songs like "Thats the Way" is charmingly bad..."hit chord..mash pedals"..but it still works. Im a rank amatuer myself so ...not much better. :(
Looks like a custom made 8 string lap steel with a palm bender on the 3rd string, on a keyboard stand.
The most impressive thing to me about Jonesy is how many instruments he's able play. Dude's a natural musician.
Of course, on the bass or keys, he's a master, but I'd wager he could pick up just about any instrument and make music of some sort.
Out of place musicians pt.2
Quote from: Mr Neutron on January 25, 2012, 07:05:58 PM
Quote from: RacerX on January 24, 2012, 10:52:16 PM
Looks big enough to be a pedal steel, but...
Did Gilbert just come from his other gig...working at an airport?
Paul Gilbert uses Extreme Isolation Headphones from Direct Sound.
http://www.extremeheadphones.com/artists-friends (http://www.extremeheadphones.com/artists-friends)
and Pete Townshend would agree, jumpsuits are awesome.
New Moog lapsteel seems pretty cool:
RR just joined the steel forum. ;D he only has his one introductory post tho thus far.
Cant wait, hope he posts some....